If given $y=5x$ where $x,y$ are real, we have an open statement, but if I write $\forall x \exists y: y = 5x$ we have a closed statement that is true, and we can even write $\forall x \exists ! y: y = 5x$ as the mapping $f: x \mapsto 5x$ is one-to-one. Now how do I make sense of the following: $\forall x: y = 5x$ (here $y$ is free) and $y=5x$ (here both $x,y$ are free). Thanks! Also, what is the difference between $\forall x \exists ! y: y = 5x$ and $\exists ! y: y = 5x$
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I have read through https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/24284/is-the-variable-in-let-y-fx-free-bound-or-neither, but the answers did not help! – Nav Bhatthal Aug 08 '23 at 09:02
1 Answers
By convention, in mathematical logic “$M$ satisfies $\varphi$” means that $M$ satisfies its universal closure: the sentence derived from $\varphi$ by universally quantifying it. So a model $M$ would satisfy $y=5x$ and $\forall x(y=5x)$ if only if it satisfied $\forall y\forall x(y=5x)$. Likewise, $M$ would satisfy $\forall x\exists!y(y=5x)$ if and only if it satisfied $\exists!y(y=5x)$.
The convention does not say that $y=5x$ and $\forall y\forall x(y=5x)$ mean the same thing, just that we should regard "$M$ satisfies $y=5x$" as meaning the same as "$M$ satisfies $\forall y\forall x(y=5x)$.
As I said, this is a convention. To illustrate further, let's say $M$ is $(\mathbb{R},+,\cdot)$. The standard definition of satisfaction (due to Tarski, and denoted $\models$) in logic says that $$M\not\models\forall y\forall x(y=5x)$$ but $$M\models\forall x\exists!y(y=5x)$$ The Tarski definition does not assign a truth-value to "$M\models y=5x$"; or rather, it assigns one only if you pick values for $x$ and $y$.
But now the convention kicks in. According to it, "$M\models y=5x$" means that $y=5x$ holds in $M$ regardless of what values you pick for $x$ and $y$. So $M\not\models y=5x$. On the other hand, $M\models\exists!y(y=5x)$.
To elaborate: $M\models y=5x$ iff $M\models\forall x\forall y(y=5x)$ because in fact, $M\not\models y=5x$ and $M\not\models\forall x\forall y(y=5x)$. What if we replace $y=5x$ with its negation? Then the convention says that $M\models y\neq 5x$ iff $M\models\forall x\forall y(y\neq 5x)$, and again $M$ satisfies neither. On the other hand, the negation of $M\models\forall x\forall y(y=5x)$ is $M\models\exists x\exists y(y\neq 5x)$, which is of course true.
What's the point of this convention? For one thing, it is useful for writing down some axioms with a minimum of clutter. We can write "$xy=yx$" for the commutative law of multiplication instead of "$\forall x\forall y(xy=yx)$".
It's also useful in setting up inference systems. The rule of universal generalization says that from $\Gamma\vdash\varphi(x)$, you can infer $\Gamma\vdash\forall x\varphi(x)$. (Here $\Gamma$ is a bunch of assumptions.) This enables you to convert to formal logic a common mode of mathematical reasoning. Namely, where you derive a result about (say) $x$ and $y$, and then conclude that since $x$ and $y$ were arbitrary, the result holds for all $x$ and $y$.
Of course, the formulas $y=5x$ and $\forall x\forall y(y=5x)$ are not equivalent for all purposes or in all senses. The first holds for some pairs $(x,y)$, the latter is just false. Negating the first gives us $\neg y=5x$, same at the inequality $y\neq 5x$, while negating $\forall x\forall y(y=5x)$ gives us a true statement equivalent to $\exists x\exists y(y\neq 5x)$.
In general, $M\not\models\varphi$ implies $M\models\neg\varphi$ only when $\varphi$ is a closed formula. So the convention must be handled with care.
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Let $A$ be the statement that $\forall x (y=5x)$ and let $B$ be the statement that $\forall x \forall y (y=5x)$, we know that $A$ only if $B$ means that when $B$ is false $A$ is false, so that when $\forall x \forall y (y=5x)$ is false, $\forall x (y=5x)$ is false, but wait, $\forall x \forall y (y=5x)$ is always false which means that $\forall x (y=5x)$ is always false. However, by definition an open statement does not have a definite truth value, where is my mistake here? Do you mean that $\forall x (y=5x)$ can never be always true? – Nav Bhatthal Aug 08 '23 at 18:07
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Thanks for the edited comment but can you directly address my claim please? – Nav Bhatthal Aug 08 '23 at 18:23
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I've edited my answer to (hopefully) make it clearer. You've pointed out some places where I was sloppy. – Michael Weiss Aug 08 '23 at 18:24
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Now you are saying that $y=5x$ and $\forall x \forall y (y=5x)$ are equivalent? That is just not true, sorry but this confused me even more. – Nav Bhatthal Aug 08 '23 at 18:26
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Hard to address your claim clearly in a comment, which is why I edited my answer. Briefly, $A$ and $B$ are not equivalent, but $M\models A$ and $M\models B$ are equivalent by convention. The alternative to the convention is to say that $M\models A$ doesn't have a meaning. – Michael Weiss Aug 08 '23 at 18:30
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Alright, Its late my time and I am going to sleep on it and come back in the morning! Learning logic from scratch is tough work. I appreciate your help! – Nav Bhatthal Aug 08 '23 at 18:33
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Can you check Rob Arthans answer on my other logic post? I like your explanations and this answer of his doesn't make much sense to me. https://math.stackexchange.com/questions/4749771/open-statements-in-first-order-logic?noredirect=1#comment10079371_4749771 thanks – Nav Bhatthal Aug 10 '23 at 12:36
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Your comment “So the truth value depends on the choice of free variable, but if for all choices, the truth value is the same, then the open statement has a fixed truth value? Just in most cases the truth value can change from true to false?” is correct. Based on that, I’d say you understand what’s going on. – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 13:02
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The convention I talk about says how to interpret the claim “$M\models\varphi$” for an open formula $\varphi$. Namely, it says that this is one of those cases where the truth value is True for all choices of the free variables. – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 13:07
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Tarski’s inductive definition of satisfaction does not include this convention. It defines satisfaction only when values have been chosen for all the free variables (if any). The convention is layered on top of this. – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 13:10
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I don’t see anything incorrect about Rob Arthan’s answer, but after the first sentence, it’s addressing an issue you didn’t have in mind: how can we prove formally that the truth value of your formula is false for all choices of $y$? – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 13:17
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Formally, I don't know how to prove it. Also when Rob assumes the open formula, is he assuming $\forall x \forall y (y=5x)$? – Nav Bhatthal Aug 10 '23 at 13:35
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Why is Rob trying to find the truth value when he isn't substituting values for $y$? Don't we have to sort all the free variables out first. – Nav Bhatthal Aug 10 '23 at 13:40
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His proof is a bit weird, it's like he's saying $y$ is a constant and by showing that two values of $y$ make this statement true then it's false. – Nav Bhatthal Aug 10 '23 at 13:49
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Maybe post another question. Comments are not a good place to go over it. – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 14:13
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Can you make an answer on that post then? I don't want to repost the same question, many thanks. – Nav Bhatthal Aug 10 '23 at 14:13
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It wouldn’t be an answer to your posted question however. It would be about how free variables are handled in formal proofs. – Michael Weiss Aug 10 '23 at 14:16
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