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Zermelo–Fraenkel Set Theory is a system of axioms for describing set theory.

For example, Zermelo–Fraenkel Set Theory says things like:

For any set $x$ and any set $y$ there exists a set $z$ such that $x \in z$ and $y ∈ z$.

I have a conjecture, and my question is, "Is my conjecture provable using only Zermelo–Fraenkel Set Theory and basic logic?"

The conjecture itself is extremely simple. However, the formal wording is ugly, so I have moved the formal conjecture to the very end of this post. If you like formalism, and hate sloppiness, then feel free to scroll of the bottom.

First, let us look at at an informal description:

We start off by being handed a function named $f$:

  • The inputs of $f$ are natural numbers.
  • The outputs of $f$ look like $(4, x)$ or $(9, y)$
  • Every output of function $f$ is an ordered pair
    • The left-most element of the pair is a natural number.
    • We do not know exactly what the right-hand element is.

input function

The function $f$ has one more special property:

  • INFORMAL EXAMPLES:
    • $f(45)$ cannot be something like $(98, x)$
    • $f(45)$ must be $(45, x)$ for some $x$
    • The numbers must match.
  • FORMAL GENERALITY:

    for some set $B$, $\forall k \in \mathbb N$, $\forall p \in \mathbb N$, $\forall b \in B$, if $f(k) = (p, b)$, then $k = p$.

We want to show that, if function $f$ exists, then the relation $g$ constructed from $f$ by removing the left-hand numbers in the ordered pairs is a function.

For example, if $f(89) = (89, x)$ then $g(89) = x$.

Formally, if there exists a set $B$ such that

$f$ is a mapping from $\mathbb{N}$ to $(\mathbb{N} \times B)$, then $g = \{(k, b): \text{$k \in \mathbb{N}$ and $b \in B$ and $f(k) = (k, b)$}\}$.

output function

BEGIN FORMALIZATION OF THE CONJECTURE:

For any set $B$, if there exists a function $f$ from $\mathbb{N}$ to $(\mathbb{N} \times B)$ such that for every $k$ in $\mathbb N$, there exists $b$ in $B$ such that $(k, (k, b))$ is in $f$, then there exists a function $g$ from $\mathbb N$ to $B$ such that for all $k \in \mathbb N$, $f(k) = (k, g(k))$.

Eric Wofsey
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    Your function $g$ is $\pi_2 \circ f$, where $\pi_2$ is the projection $\mathbb N \times B \to B$. The existence of this projection is part of the datum of a product set; or, if it's not, then you need to specify what your definition of $\mathbb N \times B$ is (which ZF doesn't). – LSpice Jun 13 '20 at 18:46
  • ℕ×B is defined as {(n, b): n ∈ ℕ and b ∈ B}. I know that *ZF* does not define the Cartesian product ℕ×B. Suppose you have a proof that uses ℕ×B. You could take that proof, and substitute the definition of ℕ×B in wherever ℕ×B occurs. That is, you can remove a proof's dependence on the definition of ℕ×B, by substituting in the definition of ℕ×B everywhere that ℕ×B is used. Thus, a proof using ℕ×B can still be provable from *ZF* if all definitions used by the proof can be reduced to things discussed in *ZF*. – Toothpick Anemone Jun 13 '20 at 19:01
  • @LSpice If a proof for a theorem relies on axioms (1), (2), and (3), but (3) is provable from (1) and (2), then the same theorem is provable from (1) and (2) only. I think it is possible for a theorem to discuss ℕ×B and be provable from *ZF, even if ℕ×B is not defined in ZF*. One can simply imagine replacing the text "ℕ×B" with the more ZF-friendly definition of ℕ×B. – Toothpick Anemone Jun 13 '20 at 19:05
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    This question is inappropriate here, because this site is for research-level mathematics. – Andreas Blass Jun 13 '20 at 19:14
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    @SamuelMuldoon, my point wasn't that you can't use $\mathbb N \times B$, but rather that, unless you use some exotic encoding of it, the projection $\pi_2$ is defineable in ZF. For example, you now have to specify what an ordered pair is. If you define $(n, b)$ to be ${{n}, {n, b}}$, as is sometimes done, then https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordered_pair#Kuratowski's_definition defines $\pi_2$. – LSpice Jun 13 '20 at 19:41

1 Answers1

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Yes, this is essentially trivial to prove. Explicitly, given that you know that $\mathbb{N}\times B$ is a set (for a proof of that, see If $X$ and $Y$ are sets, their cartesian product $X\times Y$ is a set. for instance), then your $g$ can be defined as $$\{x\in\mathbb{N}\times B:\exists k\exists b (x=(k,b)\wedge(k,(k,b))\in f)\},$$ which exists by Separation. To prove $g$ is a function, suppose $k\in\mathbb{N}$ and $b,c\in B$ are such that $(k,b)\in g$ and $(k,c)\in g$. By definition of $g$, this means that $(k,(k,b))\in f$ and $(k,(k,c))\in f$. Since $f$ is a function this implies $(k,b)=(k,c)$, and thus $b=c$. To prove the domain of $g$ is all of $\mathbb{N}$, let $k\in\mathbb{N}$; then we know there is some $b\in B$ such that $(k,(k,b))\in f$, and then $(k,b)\in g$ by definition of $g$. Similarly it is immediate from the definition that $g$ satisfies $f(k)=(k,g(k))$ for all $k\in\mathbb{N}$.

(To be clear, ordered pairs are not part of the language of ZF, so the formula $\exists k\exists b (x=(k,b)\wedge(k,(k,b))\in f)$ cannot be plugged directly into the statement of Separation. To get a formula in the language of ZF, you have to expand out $x=(k,b)$ and $(k,(k,b))\in f$ as definitions in the language of ZF, similar to the process described here for unions.)

Eric Wofsey
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  • Well.... I don't know. Paul Cohen showed that the axiom of countable choice is not provable in Zermelo–Fraenkel set theory (ZF) without the axiom of choice. If the theorem I wrote about in the question is provable in ZF, then I'm at least 70% sure that the axiom of countable choice is provable in ZF *without* the axiom of choice. – Toothpick Anemone Jun 16 '20 at 18:48
  • To define ordered pairs in *ZF* we could have (x, y) = {{x}, {x, y}} – Toothpick Anemone Jun 16 '20 at 18:51
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    @SamuelMuldoon Why do you think this would imply the provability of countable choice in $\mathsf{ZF}$? (It doesn't, Eric is correct.) – Noah Schweber Jul 25 '20 at 17:55